Tell Kai Why Chickens – Or Not

12 April 2009 | By kaidegner in Tell Kai

The issue of allowing residents in Harrisonburg to have chickens in their backyard has been documented on blogs and the newspaper. While I have had few people contact me directly, I am interested in learning more what I can about the issue before it comes before council. Contrary to what has been reported, there will NOT be an agenda item on this topic at Tuesday’s (April 14) council because information wasn’t provided in time by the citizens interested in allowing chickens to be in the backyard.

Feel free to post your thoughts and comments here – thanks!

32 Comments on “Tell Kai Why Chickens – Or Not”

  1. 13 April 2009 | Rian Dovis Said:

    I would like to give a big thumbs up for legalizing chickens in Harrisonburg! We were so sad to have to leave our 4 pet chickens in Charlottesville when we moved here in January. They are great pets and have the added benefit of providing us with nutritious food. They also provided a great learning experience for our children and help keep our family connected to our food, something that proves to be more and more important. Please support backyard chickens in Harrisonburg!

     

  2. 13 April 2009 | Josh Said:

    Kai,

    My yard is too small for chickens, so this doesn’t directly affect me in the same way as others.

    I’d like to see a list of unbiased pros and cons, simple questions and straight-forward answers. e.g. Is there an avian flu risk as suggested by local poultry industry professionals? Is this as low-impact as proponents suggest? How is this distinctly different from other forms of animal keeping in the city (dogs, cats, etc.)? Why are the current ordinances in place? Have other cities allowed chickens without any ill effects? (Were any of these cities in the heart of an agricultural region?)

    Thanks!
    Josh

     

  3. 14 April 2009 | David Miller Said:

    The only real concerns that I have heard centered around people having roosters. I think that as long as we prohibit roosters within the city, this is a win win for our community. Similar in nature to victory gardens I believe I have a right to raise my own food as long as I do not infringe on my neighbors right to a quiet neighborhood. Thanks for considering the issue carefully.

     

  4. 14 April 2009 | Alexis Said:

    I am glad to see the city considering residential chicken policies. I agree with Josh that information is necessary to make a wise decision. The media has used the Avian Flu scare to sell papers and gain viewers, so it is important for us to distinguish between sensational stories and fact. According to the US Department of Health and Human Services, only 400 cases of human Avian Flu have occurred in the last six years and none of those cases were reported in the United States. I’m not going to tell someone that they cannot practice sustainable living because there are about 60 cases of human Avian Flu each year in remote countries.

    The concerns of the poultry industry should be recognized, but there are no poultry restrictions for county residents and are not most commercial chicken houses located in the county? This virus is not airborne, it must travel through infected birds or surfaces. If the poultry industry is not concerned about restricting birds in the county, I don’t understand their concern for birds within city limits.

    Residential poultry should definitely be regulated, and I agree with the restriction on roosters, but I fully support this sustainable living practice and trust the city to make the proper decisions on protocol and permits.

     

  5. 14 April 2009 | Alexis Said:

    http://www.cdc.gov/flu/avian/gen-info/facts.htm

    (for further reading!)

     

  6. 16 April 2009 | susan Said:

    I feel that most city lots in the city are too small to allow chickens or any type of poultry. It would be very hard to control and become an unmanageable problem. If the residents would like to raise chickens why don’t they live in Rockingham County in an agriculture zoned area.

     

  7. 16 April 2009 | Brian Martin Burkholder Said:

    There clearly is a group of citizens interested in having a few egg-laying hens in their backyards. This interest connects with a larger local foods movement and a desire to live a bit closer to the land and natural world – even in the city. There are a number of other cities that have pro-chicken ordinances. With proper care and reasonable regulations, the chickens can be happy (even enclosed in portable coops), healthy (without vaccinations and hormone treatments) and safe (not contributing to biosecurity concerns being raised by some parties). It seems wise for the city to regulate backyard chickens, thereby allowing for education concerning care for chickens and concerns of others, rather than not engage the presenting issue and leave people who choose to have chickens in the city anyway do so in a less cared for manner.

     

  8. 16 April 2009 | Beth Said:

    I’m concerned about how the commercial poultry industry would have an effect on MY chickens. It should not be the other way. Oh, and my body and the environment. I think we should be questioning them about their unsustainable practices rather than them questioning the HBCP.

    I also think that having backyard chickens is going to be a great way for neighbors to connect, and to add some excitement to the neighborhoods. I’m really looking forward to having some in my backyard since I eat 2 eggs every morning!!

     

  9. 20 April 2009 | Ray Said:

    This is a bad idea. Hundreds of chickens within the city limits. What’s next? Goats? Pigs? Sheep? We live in the city for a reason. Farms and farm animals belong in the county.

    If each of my neighbors has a half-dozen chickens, there might be hundreds just in my neighborhood alone, and I can only imagine what will happen when the neighborhood cats go after them. Even if this is regulated, there’s no way the city would have the resources to monitor and enforce it.

     

  10. 21 April 2009 | jill humphrey Said:

    many other areas – much more urban than harrisonburg, i.e. seattle, nyc, charlottesville – have managed backyard chickens without spiraling into overwhelming farm animal chaos. it seems that reasonable precedent reveals that chickens in my backyard may be quite feasible and beneficial. so, kai, i say – yes to chickens!

     

  11. 22 April 2009 | - of chicken myths. « the state Said:

    [...] heard the man!  go post your opinions for kai’s reading [...]

     

  12. 22 April 2009 | Lee Good Said:

    Kai,
    Chickens that are well cared for will provide eggs that are significantly healthier (see http://www.motherearthnews.com/eggs.aspx) than commercially raised hens. They can help recycle table scraps (my birds LOVE carrot peelings), and even provide insect protections. (They eat almost any insect, including adult Japanese beetles.) They also provide hours of entertainment, can teach children countless lessons on responsibility, and can tangibly connect us to a food source. There is no question that hens can be responsibly kept on many city lots, without creating nuisance problems. Like with all animals, chickens require food, fresh water and space. They can be raised to be friendly, and have interesting individual personalities. I am in favor of the city allowing regulated backyard chickens.

     

  13. 24 April 2009 | seth Said:

    i mentioned it over on the state, and perhaps most people are aware, but there seems to be a misconception that you can own chickens anywhere in the county. my understanding is that there are zoning classifications that don’t allow it. maybe not incredibly relevant, but useful to know if one of your talking points is that whoever wants them has chickens in the county and it doesn’t cause problems.

    thanks for looking at this kai. i hope you’re able to come up with a proposal everyone can agree on.

     

  14. 24 April 2009 | erin Said:

    I agree with Josh.

    Also, I certainly don’t want to destroy the livelihood of poultry farmers, but allowing the Poultry Federation the power to dictate the rules concerning backyard chickens would be like allowing Walmart or Food Lion to say that we aren’t allowed to have a farmer’s market because it hurts their grocery business. The rights of a business do not supercede those of an individual.

     

  15. 24 April 2009 | Jennifer Monger Said:

    I am fully in favor of having hens allowed within the city limits of Harrisonburg. I have no need of a noisy rooster to have laying hens. Even in a small backyard, these animals are not a hazard or nuisance…they eat insects such as ticks and beetles, and chicken poop is a wonderful compost material that would highly benefit my garden (which I grow in city limits without being limited by agricultural zoning restrictions). Chickens grown in my backyard would not affect the local poultry industry in either direction, as my hens would have no contact with their inbred, caged and chemically fed stock. My child will have the benefit of raising a few hens, collecting eggs and getting in touch with part of his potential food supply in a way in which he has little opportunity otherwise, as all his food comes in nice sterile packages. I expect it will raise his awareness of nature and life cycles.
    As far as annoying the neighbors, I doubt any hens could make as much racket as the dog next door who is left out to bark all night.

     

  16. 24 April 2009 | Mark Keller Said:

    I am very much in favor of having small chickens allowed in the city. Just as dogs and cats are allowed but not to roam around on other neighbors property, the ownership of chickens will bring great joy and promote gardening. I have lived in other cities in the US where chickens are allowed. Our children were able to understand a lot about food production, the joy of caring for an animal that produces food and they gathered the eggs with enthusiasm. It really is a lot of fun! I agree we should not have roosters. They might cause the dogs to bark more than they do already:)

     

  17. 24 April 2009 | Bryan Said:

    Disease risk to humans is very low with proper care. The family farms with chickens near the factory farms seem like more of a risk.

    Here is a news report on backyard chickens in the San Francisco bay area:

    http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/assignment_7&id=6583109

     

  18. 24 April 2009 | Greg Sachs Said:

    I believe a few chickens in your own backyard is a great plus for envionmental sustainability, and provides a good way of connecting ourselves to our food sources. This connection is important, as it helps to inform our daily food choices in a way that benefits our health and local economy. I ‘ll also second the comment about chickens being much less of a nuisance than dogs.

    After hearing the concerns raised about biosecurity, I did some research and found that numerous studies and reports on the role of “backyard poultry” in outbreaks was negligable.

    You really can’t beat a freshly laid egg either. However you cook them, they’re delicious.

     

  19. 24 April 2009 | Greg Sachs Said:

    Reading what I just wrote–I need an editor. “…found that numerous studies reported the role of “backyard poultry” in outbreaks to be negligable. …”

    For instance, http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TBK-4VGDNK6-4&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=1fa81dfa92294a0a70727e899f36a2b8

     

  20. 24 April 2009 | Matt Trost Said:

    Definitely in favor of having some clucky “ladies”, as I call them, in the back yard. There are so many reasons why they should be allowed. My children learn a ton by watching them, and watching my wife and I care for them.

    It’s important to us to know that our food hasn’t been laced with hormones, antibiotics, etc. that come along with a large portion of what we find in the supermarket. The eggs we get from our hens are loaded with vitamins and nutrients you can’t get from factory-raised hens. Our hens were enclosed on our garden plot for a fall and winter, totally composting everything we threw at them. You should have seen the garden the following spring and summer. The city didn’t have to deal with our scraps, or our leaves that year either. I’m concerned with the risks associated with having 20,000 chickens raised in confinement, and what that means for my health and the health of my hens. I don’t think it’s a valid point to say that my hens are a threat to the growers. My birds’ immune system is much stronger than any confined bird could dream of. Of course, you can’t keep the interaction with other birds from happening, and possible contraction of disease can’t be totally eliminated (even in a confinement operation).

    I think what the HBCP is requesting will be a great program for the city! They have done their homework, and are doing their best to give the city a viable, friendly option for responsible citizens.

     

  21. 24 April 2009 | kaidegner Said:

    Thanks for everyone’s contributions and questions, on all sides of the issue! This issue certainly has a lot of dimensions, and I appreciate exploring them with you. Any links you have to examples and research supporting any of the arguments is welcome.

    I see the benefit of backyard chickens, and the questions for me remain around health, enforcement, cost and predatory issues. I’m reading research on the health issues. Are there practical ways for the city to enforce people having only six chickens? The $5 fee seems like it wouldn’t cover the necessary increased workload to manage a database of chicken permits. Will chickens attract predators (neighbor cats?)?

    Ray, on the point of what’s next (ducks, pigs, etc), all I can say is I’m only looking at this one issue – and any other animal would needs its own review! I have a feeling those other animals would cause more of an impact than what the hens seems to. The question of density, though, is interesting – would lots of hens in a neighborhood cause any problems? My hunch is having them spread out even a backyard apart in their “chicken tractors” might mitigate that problem, but I’m no expert.

    Seth, thanks for the question about whether the county allows chickens in more dense residential zoning areas – I’ll check that, and on the reasoning if it’s so.

    For those not in favor of allowing chickens in the backyard, can you find evidence of negative impacts in cities that have allowed hens? That would be helpful to review as well!

    Thanks for the links you sent – I’ll go explore some more.

     

  22. 28 April 2009 | Ray Said:

    Kai, since you mentioned density, how will the city deal with multi-family dwellings? If there are several families under one roof, i.e., a duplex or apartment, will each family or individual be allowed to have 6 backyard chickens?

    And as far as backyard birds not being a disease threat, you should read these stories from Los Angeles:

    8,000 California Birds Killed in Bid to Stop Virus

    http://tinyurl.com/cp6zq4

    He said he had been startled by the number of people in the Los Angeles metropolitan region who keep chickens and other fowl on their property as pets or sources of food.

    ”The sheer volume of these backyard birds has been eye-opening to us,” Dr. Breitmeyer said. ”Some of these birds, including chickens, are like pets to these people. It’s amazing how emotionally attached people get to them.”

    ***

    California; Disease Task Force Eyeing Pet Birds; Authorities are going door-to-door searching for parrots and poultry alike. If the avians appear sick, they are killed on the spot.

    http://tinyurl.com/c4×3x8

    Following the discovery of Newcastle last year, authorities ordered birds in Los Angeles, Orange, Riverside, San Bernardino and San Diego counties quarantined. The lockdown was recently extended to Santa Barbara, Ventura and Imperial counties. New cases have been discovered in Nevada and Arizona. People who move birds out of the quarantined areas could face a $25,000 fine.

    Last month, task force members, accompanied by police officers, showed up at Deanna Wood’s home in Mira Loma. Carrying a forced- entry warrant, they pushed through her backyard gate and seized her pet rooster, four hens and two ducks. They placed the birds in a large cardboard barrel. Wood said she stood in horror, listening to the birds shriek as task force members filled the barrel with carbon dioxide.

    ***

    Poultry quarantine extended
    Emergency declared in 6 southern counties

    http://tinyurl.com/cbfypr

    Racing to contain a disease that has forced the slaughter of about 1.2 million chickens in recent weeks, the federal government on Wednesday expanded a quarantine to cover all chickens in Southern California, as Gov. Gray Davis declared a state of emergency in six counties.

    The nearly simultaneous moves are a concerted push to eradicate exotic Newcastle disease, among the most infectious poultry diseases, before it ravages California’s $3 billion annual poultry industry.

    ***

    Let’s just be sure we are having an informed discussion here.

     

  23. 29 April 2009 | Beth Said:

    Ray,

    Thanks for posting those articles. I had not heard about the outbreak in CA. What I got out of these articles were a few things:
    We cannot allow ourselves to live in fear. While the spread of disease is scary, it seems that we could learn from the outbreak in CA. Harrisonburg should be concerned about disease, however, I think it has been blown out of proportion in many instances (b/c of the fear thing). It seemed like there was no regulation or registration of chickens where the outbreak started and that folks were surprised by peoples emotional connection to the pets. The HBCP gave a great presentation to the city council last night and I think that it addressed all the concerns quite well. They also have offered themselves as an educational group to help out once it is legal, which is really great and community building! I think that in a lot of places where the outbreaks are happening, there are no regulations as to how many, how to take care of them, etc. Also, there really wouldn’t be a global chicken/animal disease crisis/chaos if we set up ourselves in a resilient manner. The way the commercial poultry industry is run, it makes it really easy for disease to spread, no matter where it comes from! So, lets look at where the outbreaks have happened, what was the situation there and what can we do to make sure that doesn’t happen here.

     

  24. 04 May 2009 | seth Said:

    thanks to lowell fulk for checking into county zoning and verifying that you cannot keep livestock in residentially zoned parts of the county.

     

  25. 05 May 2009 | Richard Said:

    But most Rockingham County residences, outside of the towns and planned developments such as Belmont, Massanutten, and the area outside of H’burg on the east, are on property that’s zoned agricultural.

     

  26. 06 May 2009 | seth Said:

    true,
    here’s the map if anyone’s curious….
    http://rockingham.gisbrowser.com/docs/Zoning.pdf

     

  27. 18 July 2009 | docHart Said:

    Here’s an interesting article from the CDC on the dangers of salmonella and backyard chickens:

    http://www.cdc.gov/healthypets/pdf/intown_flocks.pdf

     

  28. 19 July 2009 | docHart Said:

    Some have expressed concern about unwanted, hungry cats and dogs being attracted to their neighborhoods looking for an easy meal if backyard cjickens were present.

    Here’s a link to *other* predators that could find attracted to urban chickens:

    http://www.backyardchickens.com/LC-predators.html

    And yes, it is a big enough problem that this site has devoted an entire thread to handling these predators and other pests at:

    http://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewforum.php?id=13

    No, I am not engaging in “fear tactics.” I simply believe that we need to take off the rosy glasses and look at both the reality and consequences of urban backyard chickens.

     

  29. 21 July 2009 | Stu Said:

    One question I have is…is it really worth it to jeopardize one of the biggest industries in the area so that less than 5% of the community can have their way? The city just finished the farmer’s market downtown… a GREAT place to “buy fresh, buy local”. Why not just support these people? Obviously, I am AGAINST chickens in the city. Who will police this? Who will enforce any ordnance? What is the effect on my property value if my neighbors decide to do this? Why can’t you just enjoy this city the way it is, and make your purchases from any of several farms in the area that sell their own products? Leave the city alone and enjoy it for what it is… a great place to live! and support your local farmers as well!

     

  30. 27 July 2009 | docHart Said:

    It appears now that the HBCP wants to reduce the lot size minimum to 7,000 sq. ft. with an offset of 10 ft. from the property line so that more residents of Harrisonburg will be able to keep chickens.

    Has anyone given thought to the fact that are *several* Home Owner Associations (including the many townhouse developments that are springing up all over town) in H’burg whose by-laws would prohibit chickens not matter what the lot size/offest is?

    Have members of the HBCP checked to see if they themselves would be restricted by their HOA? Or their landlord if they are renting? Or any other restriction that would override whatever Council decides?

    In short, passing *any* ordinance to allow backyard chickens would *not* enable *every* resident of H’Burg to keep chickens.

    All it would do is create a situation where only those of us who do not want chickens next door to us and are not protected by an HOA or other restrictions will have to suffer the consequences.

    And that is called injustice through privilege and inequality.

     

  31. 28 July 2009 | M Alan Said:

    Kai and local citizens, google “Hawaii Chicken Problem”. If you want Harrisonburg to be like this, go ahead. Don’t be complaining when money has to be allocated to clean up this mess.

     

  32. 22 October 2009 | Mark71 Said:

    There is no sharing That does not lead to a project. ,

     

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